Frenemies

Posted: Friday, November 02, 2007 7:49 AM by Dan Fleschner

(From Janet Shamlian, NBC News Correspondent)

I was trying to keep up with my five little trick or treaters as they worked the neighborhood a few nights ago. Keeping pace alongside me was a mom from a few streets over. I hadn't seen her in months. "I saw you on TV in a really bad outfit recently," she said with a smile, "but I have to say you made the most of it." And then it hit me, she was a frenemy.

It's a word I hadn't heard until recently but a relationship many of us have experienced. There are a number of definitions... but most agree, at its core, a frenemy is someone who upsets you as much as they make you feel good.

I traveled to Jerrico, New York, for a roundtable with a group of women to discuss frenemies for TODAY. WATCH VIDEO

They're neighbors who juggle children, husbands and jobs and yet maintain active and supportive friendships with each other. They'd all had frenemies in the past, but now in their forties told me they'd become more choosy and divorced themselves from toxic friends. What a group. Think Wisteria Lane -- smart, fun and beautiful women -- but without any of the underlying deceit, jealously and competitiveness.

Turns out hanging out with people who make you feel bad can also be hard on the heart. Researchers at Brigham Young University found the relationships can be harmful to your health. Experts say it's best to cut those ties, but I can't do that with my neighbor until I know which outfit she was talking about!

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Comments

What do you do when your "frenemy" is your daughter? My daughter, now 31, has always said hateful things to me, disguised with a chuckle or attempt to be "helpful." I just can't stand being in the same room with her because I know she will find a way to make a loud comment about me to anyone within earshot.

Nancy, Greeneville, TN (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 9:41 AM)

This response is from Leslie, one of the Jericho ladies that appeared in your segment. Thanks for visiting with us Janet.

You point out that hanging with people who make you feel bad can be hard on your heart and your mind. I just want to take a moment to emphasize how hanging with people who love you as you are and support you can enrich and improve your life. Once you have experienced that, you can't possibly allow yourself to tolerate toxic friends.

These women in the segment, my best friends, "The Vuvs," are extraordinary women whose qualities include loyalty, honesty, humor, compassion and kindness. Being a part of this group has transformed us and shown us that we can love each other despite our imperfections and accept each other’s life decisions and “shtick” in a non-judgmental way. Another significant way this friendship has transformed us is that we are each others role models in so many ways, barometers for each other of where our lives are and where we do and do not want them to be. Our constant validation and honest criticism of each other has made us better wives, mothers, sisters, daughters, friends and has advanced or shaped all of our careers.

I am proud of the example we are setting for our daughters about female friendship and I am intent on continuing to debunk the myth that women can't be friends in groups.

Leslie Adler (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 9:45 AM)

Great report. I have been dealing with frenemies for a while and I was getting very depress. Not only that, my marriage was in trouble for it. I tried to talk to my "friends" about their comments but they always denied their actions towards me. They made me feel that there was somethig wrong with me for seeing things that "were not there". This is the first time a hear the word frenemies and I can definately see clearer now. thank you

Pam portocarrero, RPB, FL (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 9:54 AM)

I tuned into the segment about "Frenemies" today. I couldn't believe it! I thought I was the only one who had this situation. I am 43 yrs old and have a "friend" who has been a subtle tormenter most of my life. I am strong and have been able to conquer it rather remarkably. My "other" friends can't believe that I haven't freaked out by now. What I have done is the best thing...I ignore it. I feel good knowing that I am being "the better person". I would like to know the frenemy website address. It was mentioned on the TV segment but I can't find it. I would love to communicate more with people who have this situation.

Jane Doe (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 10:40 AM)

Ugh! Please stop trying to sell women this term coined on "Sex in the City" it is insulting to women's intelligence.What is this - "The View"? Women like that are just cruel and malicious for whatever their obnoxious reasons are. I worked with two women who were like that for five years. When I started my new job, I encountered similar women. Believe me, I didn't let them even start. The second you hear something cruel come out of their mouth, you tell them " That was creal and mean- there must be something wrong with you to say that" Boom! That is it and you walk away. If they try to engage you again, you tell them " I don't want to hear it."
Don't engage with them again until they can speak in a civil manner and even then be careful.

Anneke Libertyville, Illinios (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 10:42 AM)

Recently I told a friend that I was looking for a
job in the field of my dreams - journalism. She has
made several nasty comments to me such as "You should
just take a job, look at your age" and "Well, you have to be really polished to go into that field." There are things I really like about this friend, but her comments hurt me. She makes these remarks under the guise that she is trying to help me. I have forgiven her for her lack of tact, but I now realize she'd probably like to see me fail so she could feel better about herself. I have considered just cutting off the relationship, but I see her frequently. It would be uncomfortable to see her so I continue to put up with this. I call her the velvet hammer. She hits me over the head and I never see it coming.

Wendy Hogan, Titusville, NJ (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 10:43 AM)

I'M IN A SITUATION NOW THAT HAS OPENED MY EYES TO "FRENEMIES"...WHEN I FINALLY GET AWAY FROM THIS COUPLE (WHO DEFINATELY DESERVE EACH OTHER) I WILL SO BE ON THE ALERT TO ANY "NEW" FRIENDS IN MY LIFE.

JEAN JOHNSON (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 10:43 AM)

Yes! This segment hit home with a situation I had with a frenemy. These women are "nice" and also at the same time can be"know it alls" or seem to have the latest knowledge of whats being said or done in the neighborhood. This person usually disguises herself as a "do-gooder" bringing casseroles to people and pushing her way into their lives...along with kind words but also snippets of gossip or information that she says you need to know this so "They" won't talk about us.". BEWARE... I learned the hard way and I am a bit more guarded since this FRENEMY is out of my life. The older I get the more I realize that what my grandmother used to say...Count yourself blessed if you have at least one true friend...

cynthia D. Arkansas (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 10:54 AM)

I found this article about friends to be so true
I have a friend that is always saying something negitive about my hair and it hurts my feelings. I would never to do that to anyone.

June Somers,Monticello, NY. (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 11:47 AM)

The segment about 'frenemies' on this morning's Today Show left out a very important side effect when it comes to dropping a toxic friend. I walked away from a longtime frenemy and in the process lost the relationship with the rest of my friends who were also connected to this group. I couldn't accept sitting at the same table with her and chose not to participate in our weekly gatherings anymore. She kept going and I guess her 'loud' presents was more convincing than my 'silent' absence. She is still getting the invitations while nobody remembers me anymore. Without getting into further detail I want to explain that this frenemy betrayed me by revealing very privat/personal information about me to place herself in a better position while she was trying to compete for a possible date. Her actions made me feel terribly vulnerable. She was my very best friend and knew everything about me.
So, it's not all that simple Al! Dropping a toxic friend could mean loosing a whole lot more than just that......

Reni Spears, Killeen, Texas (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 11:51 AM)

What a great story! Finally, someone has put a name to what keeps me depressed..So, what do you do when the frenenemy is a relative and your mom's friend..?? Thanks for at least letting me know I am not crazy and not alone! KM

K.Matthes Monroe, MI (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 12:15 PM)

AMEN how many of us still keep toxic friends around only because they have been friends for years...how do you get rid of them?

Joan Charlotte, NC (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 12:25 PM)

Hi Janet,
I loved the piece...Leslie Adler said it best in her comments. True friends, best friend are ones who accept you: the good, bad and ugly parts of you. They are there to celebrate the best of times and they are your support system through the worst of times. They love you unconditionally. Reason, season, lifetime...there some friends you have for a reason, and some friendships which last a season, but when you are really lucky there are the ones, like my vuv's...who are lifetimers!!! Maybe when you are fortunate enough to have a bond this close, it make it easier to see right through the frenemies/toxic friends...and drop em' like a hot potato!!!!

Michelle Collins (one of the VUV's) (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 3:53 PM)

What a relief to know that others are seeing what I have seen in my sister who has been my frenemies undercover! Smiling in my face and stabbing me in the back with her family and their friends even though I and my children have financially taken care of her in her bad times. She is married now and doesn't want anything to do with me even though she owes me thousands of dollars and has turned my brother against me. She has been the most toxic person in my life. How does one get over your sister's betrayal?? Atleast I know I am not being over sensitive since hearing your story and putting a real name to this madness is refreshing and freeing.

Shirley Jackson, Houston, Texas (Sent Friday, November 02, 2007 11:58 PM)

Why didn't Leslie respond to Nancy's comment about her daughter being "toxic" instead of responding to Janet? We all know when we don't want to be friends with someone; what about close relatives - including parents? "You can choose your friends." What do you teach your daughters about respecting parents who are not as much fun or as nourishing as your friends?

Sisi (Sent Saturday, November 03, 2007 9:42 AM)

Sometimes "frenemies" are a way of linking families together... that's my now problem... your kids our kids, his kids her kids.... it's a lot of work and being 45 years old and having expierenced some physical changes in the last year.. I sometimes feel like the ugly duckling of the group... My birthday was Nov. 2 and all the cards i received had to do with sagging breasts and rear ends... well if i had the time energy and the money to get myself a physical trainer I'd give these smoking, joking beer toting girls a run for thier money.... even when some are in thier 20's... some day the joke will be on them... and as thier looks fade from hanging in bars every free hour they have... then i will be the one send the "gag" cards to the girls.. oh and by the way I'm the only one who is married... and my husband thinks I'm wonderful... and that's really what counts....

Sandy Johnson Thorhurst Pa (Sent Saturday, November 03, 2007 7:20 PM)

I agree with Reni about losing a toxic friend can cause you to lose your whole circle of friends. Then what happens? It always seems the one with the loudest mouth is the "friend" that everyone hangs on to. Trust me in my circle of friends everyone knows that this one is Toxic but they are afraid to let go because our teenage girls are involved. This child also controls all the teenagers like her mother and the girls dont want to be left out either. It can impact both the adults and the children. How do you handle that situation? Why is it so hard to find true friends in todays competitive world? Any insight would be most helpful.

Barbara, Amityville, NY (Sent Sunday, November 04, 2007 7:50 AM)

I found this artcle to be interesting. I nver heard of this word before but I like it. I have many frenemies. It's like I don't mind being around them but there is a sence of tension between us and then when they leave, they talk about me, I talk about them but if they were ever needing help, I would help them.

Glo Gamboa, Lamar CO (Sent Wednesday, November 07, 2007 10:43 AM)

What hypocrisy ! What to save fuel. Then sending reporters to both poles

Davdi k putnam (Sent Wednesday, November 07, 2007 11:17 AM)

I found so relieved when found this article. I used to have a frenemy, she used to be my very best friend but the more I kept on hanging out with her, the more depressed I were. I ditched her at the end awaring that I would lost the entire group (my friends who were also hers). It took the entire group for around two years to realize how toxic she was! At the end, our friends ended up ditching her too and they were on my side (after I finally told them the truth why we went splitville). Our friends ditched her not because I talked bad about her, but they finally could experience how selfish, jealous and competitive she was. I think when we have these kind of friends the best thing we could do is to separate ourselves from them and just be who you are because your other friends would see the truth (in case the frenemies badmouthed you to others). And right now I am reunited again with the group.
I still have some frenemies but since my experience with my previous best friend, I am more alert and can smell the toxic scent earlier so I can take more precautions in dealing with them and usually I just take distance before eventually dissapear from their life. There is no benefit in having frenemies around you. When you are sincere and positive, you will eventually attract and stick with people who are the same as you.

Vendela, New York City, New York (Sent Wednesday, November 07, 2007 2:01 PM)

I too had a fremeny. She tried to compete with me , said things about my weight, secretly told people bad things about me and God only knows what else she's capable of. I'm using past tense since I don't want anything to do with her.Yes I am prepared to lose friends but if they are really true then they'll believe me! Honestly my frenemy is as vicious as they come. And I did so much to help her out and what did I get out of it? Seems that jealousy is a huge factor in this (guy). That and she's very inmature.But I have to say that now I am much more aware and won't let anyone like that near me again!!

Cassie Costanza, queens NY (Sent Monday, November 26, 2007 12:23 PM)

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